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Death Valley Driver Video Review Message Board > DVDVR Forums > Them's Fightin' Words
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TOM
QUOTE(Cell @ Feb 7 2007, 08:57 PM) *
Come again? I understand the worthless point, but I really don't get what that last part meant, the wording is throwing me off.


I just read the other day that Sherk had seriously injured his knee. I figured it was probably commonly known since I haven't been paying that close attention. Maybe I'm wrong. And if the info is correct it said he might be out a minimum of 12 weeks before he can start to train again.
Cell
Oh, I knew Sherk had surgery on his rotator cuff, but I had no idea he hurt his knee. The guy goes his entire career injury free and when he finally wins a title he gets injured, what shitty luck.
Lethal_Striker
I believe that Sherk is due back in July.
Newman
Just something I noticed glancing over the lists; I think I understand why it's the way it is, but....

You've got Pe De Pano at #66, which is justifiable seeing as he's only had four fights and is 2-2, but for some reason it doesn't seem fair that a guy who he tooled in Mir is still sitting pretty at #16. I realize that Mir has since beaten Christison (and lost to Vera, but Vera was above him anyway...) and Cruz has lost his following two fights, but that doesn't seem to have the effect of moving one guy way down and the other up elsewhere in the lists (Rodriguez still below Beraun, for example).

Eh, I know I'm a bitter Pe De Pano fan anyway (I thought he won the decision against Monson and the Arlovski fight could've been NCd on the Radach/Berger ruling) but still, this stuck out to me as something worth asking about.
TOM
QUOTE(Newman @ Feb 13 2007, 04:32 AM) *
Just something I noticed glancing over the lists; I think I understand why it's the way it is, but....

You've got Pe De Pano at #66, which is justifiable seeing as he's only had four fights and is 2-2, but for some reason it doesn't seem fair that a guy who he tooled in Mir is still sitting pretty at #16. I realize that Mir has since beaten Christison (and lost to Vera, but Vera was above him anyway...) and Cruz has lost his following two fights, but that doesn't seem to have the effect of moving one guy way down and the other up elsewhere in the lists (Rodriguez still below Beraun, for example).

Eh, I know I'm a bitter Pe De Pano fan anyway (I thought he won the decision against Monson and the Arlovski fight could've been NCd on the Radach/Berger ruling) but still, this stuck out to me as something worth asking about.


You explained it right for yourself already. Cruz hasn't done anything besides beat Mir which was a "gimme" fight for Pe De Pano given both of their respective skillsets.

I don't like Mir being where he is either but that's how it is for now. And I am also a Pe De Pano fan.
TOM
Updated again...I think it's 2/22/07 but I could be off by a day or two.
Lethal_Striker
Just making a listing of the Pride 33 and UFC 68 fighters rankings for myself. So I can see how far they've gone up and down the list on the next update.

HEAVYWEIGHTS
5. TIM SYLVIA – MFS
13. SERGEI KHARITONOV – RTT
23. ALISTAIR OVEREEM – GOLDEN GLORY
113. MICHAEL RUSSOW

LIGHT HEAVYWEIGHTS
2. WANDERLAI SILVA – CHUTE BOXE
3. SHOGUN RUA – CHUTE BOXE
9. ANTONIO ROGERIO NOGUEIRA – BTT
10. JASON LAMBERT – NCFA
12. RENATO BABALU – GBCT
28. TRAVIS WIUFF – ELITE PERFORMANCE
53. JAMES LEE – MASH ACADEMY
87. MATT HAMILL – TEAM PUNISHMENT
93. DREW MCFEDRIES

MIDDLEWEIGHTS
3. DAN HENDERSON – TEAM QUEST
5. RICH FRANKLIN – TEAM GURGEL
8. KAZUO MISAKI – TEAM GRABAKA
14. MARTIN KAMPMANN – TEAM XYIENCE
34. JASON MACDONALD – PRO CAMP
35. FRANK TRIGG – TEAM XYIENCE
225. RAMON THIERRY SOKOUDJOU – TEAM QUEST

WELTERWEIGHTS
2. MATT HUGHES – MFS
6. JON FITCH – AKA
14. NICK DIAZ – CESAR GRACIE
27. CHRIS LYTLE – IMA
50. LUIGI FIORIVANTI – ATT ORLANDO
75. GLEISON TIBAU – ATT

LIGHTWEIGHTS
1. TAKANORI GOMI – TEAM RASCAL/KIGUCHI DOJO
8. HAYATO SAKURAI – MACH DOJO
39. MAC DANZIG – MILLENIA JJ
70. JASON DENT – TEAM GRIFFONRAWL
97. JAY IRELAND – TEAM GOMEZ/TEAM TAP OR SNAP
143. JAMIE VARNER – ACS

NOT RANKED
Randy Couture
Jason Gilliam
Rex Holman
TOM
QUOTE(Lethal_Striker @ Feb 25 2007, 10:16 PM) *
NOT RANKED
Randy Couture
Jason Gilliam
Rex Holman


I should note that both Gilliam and Holman were ranked and got lost in an edit (this I think is common so if anyone notices something like these please let me know). I put 'em both back in. Holman is at #110 LHW and I don't know how Gilliam got out of there but he's at # 78 LW.

Go Couture!
gordi
QUOTE(TOM @ Feb 28 2007, 12:03 PM) *
QUOTE(Lethal_Striker @ Feb 25 2007, 10:16 PM) *
NOT RANKED
Randy Couture
Jason Gilliam
Rex Holman


I should note that both Gilliam and Holman were ranked and got lost in an edit (this I think is common so if anyone notices something like these please let me know). I put 'em both back in. Holman is at #110 LHW and I don't know how Gilliam got out of there but he's at # 78 LW.

Go Couture!



I might be missing him, but I don't see Roger Gracie on your list. He beat Ron Waterman by submission at the first BodogFight PPV.
TOM
QUOTE(gordi @ Feb 28 2007, 01:29 PM) *
I might be missing him, but I don't see Roger Gracie on your list. He beat Ron Waterman by submission at the first BodogFight PPV.


It'll take another fight yet out of Roger before he makes it on to the list. At this point I consider his one fight more of a special attraction and a one time thing.

But thank you for noticing, sir.
Lethal_Striker
Roger won't be fighting again until minimum of the summer, since he is going against Lister at ADCC in the superfight.
TOM
Updated rankings as of 3/5/07.

Some rankings were also affected by my deleting several fighters due to inactivity since I had some spare time.


Cell
Hey TOM, just a few notes, Marquardt trains up at Jackson's now, and Mayhem Miller lists himself as training full time with Hendo at TQ LA.
Lethal_Striker
QUOTE
LYOTO – BLACK HOUSE


Should be listed as Ryoto Machida, Lyoto is just his nickname.
JTU
Eh, Mayhem Miller's first name isn't really "Mayhem." Let it slide, dude.
TOM
QUOTE(Lethal_Striker @ Mar 5 2007, 10:02 PM) *
Should be listed as Ryoto Machida, Lyoto is just his nickname.


Wait, his full given name isn't an all capital letter single word? You're fucking crazy if you think I'll believe that.
WPShow
TOM, do you not rank people in multiple weight classes, because it strikes me as odd to not see the PRIDE 205 lb champ listed in the top 10.
evilclown
QUOTE(TOM @ Mar 6 2007, 08:21 AM) *
QUOTE(Lethal_Striker @ Mar 5 2007, 10:02 PM) *
Should be listed as Ryoto Machida, Lyoto is just his nickname.


Wait, his full given name isn't an all capital letter single word? You're fucking crazy if you think I'll believe that.


Apparently "Cro Cop" isn't the dudes real last name either. What a world we live in.
Hollinger.
Man I wish my surname was Cro Cop.
TOM
QUOTE(WPShow @ Mar 6 2007, 03:22 PM) *
TOM, do you not rank people in multiple weight classes, because it strikes me as odd to not see the PRIDE 205 lb champ listed in the top 10.


I don't normally but I was thinking that yeah, I might have to throw Henderson into the LHW rankings in this case. The new Dan Henderson rule.

Team Quest...fucking up all my rankings this month.
Jumbo Rickuta
Does that mean we need to call him Frank Juarez? Cause I'm cool with that.
frenziedme
QUOTE(TOM @ Mar 6 2007, 07:40 PM) *
QUOTE(WPShow @ Mar 6 2007, 03:22 PM) *
TOM, do you not rank people in multiple weight classes, because it strikes me as odd to not see the PRIDE 205 lb champ listed in the top 10.


I don't normally but I was thinking that yeah, I might have to throw Henderson into the LHW rankings in this case. The new Dan Henderson rule.

Team Quest...fucking up all my rankings this month.


Just wait until after April 14th.
JTU
Wait, what's April 14th?
El Oso Grande
QUOTE(UberCat @ Mar 7 2007, 09:22 AM) *
Wait, what's April 14th?


The day Lindland goes from 185 to #1 Heavyweight?
JTU
AHA, thank you.
TOM
Updated 3/10/07
Lethal_Striker
Will wins on TUF 5 affect the LW rankings?
TOM
QUOTE(Lethal_Striker @ Mar 11 2007, 07:44 PM) *
Will wins on TUF 5 affect the LW rankings?


Yes. A win is a win, IMO.
theiceman
One thing I've been trying to figure out is how Tito Ortiz has managed to retain such a high ranking. Would you mind offering me some input here? Just seems like he hasn't done anything of note for years.
JTU
That's actually a pretty interesting question. Going by the "what have you done for me lately" rationale, you can make an argument for Rashad being ahead of Tito (recent wins against #8 Lambert and #11 Jardine vs. a recent win against #14 Griffin). I was going to say that you could make an argument for Jardine too, but then again the Bonnar loss is kind of glaring on his record. Everything else is kind of murky, though. (Hendo only has the one major win at 205, Silva has the losses to Hendo and Arona, Arona has the loss to Silva, LYOTO has no losses but only one win against a top 20 fighter, 4 years ago, Jackson doesn't have any recent top 20 wins, and Lambert has the Evans loss.)
theiceman
I've been looking over anything, and it just seems like Tito should be one spot either above or below Rampage. I guess it depends how much emphasis you put on the Forrest win and Page's losses to Silva/Shogun.
TOM
QUOTE(theiceman @ Mar 13 2007, 08:50 PM) *
One thing I've been trying to figure out is how Tito Ortiz has managed to retain such a high ranking. Would you mind offering me some input here? Just seems like he hasn't done anything of note for years.


Well, Tito beat a formerly high ranked Belfort a couple years back and a still highly ranked Griffin recently. You're basically right though in that he is ranked primarily on past merits. But no one else has been consistent enough or active enough to knock him down, IMO. Although if Rampage gets winning consistently again he will pass him back up. Plus the Rashad fight will be obviously big for rankings.
TOM
Updated today...3/19 I think.
Tony J.
I thought Lawler beating Trigg would make your rankings go a little haywire. I can't imagine what Serra's win will do.
TOM
QUOTE(Tony J. @ Apr 8 2007, 11:28 PM) *
I thought Lawler beating Trigg would make your rankings go a little haywire. I can't imagine what Serra's win will do.


Updated to include that Serra win, etc. from this past weekend. Today = April 9th.
Cell
Hey TOM, were you aware that Ivan Menjivar officially retired from the sport, and even went so far as to say he's not even bothering to train or work out at all anymore, to work for the government (or some job like that) late last year, or are you just wating a while to remove him from the rankings?
evilclown
QUOTE(Cell @ Apr 9 2007, 10:31 PM) *
Hey TOM, were you aware that Ivan Menjivar officially retired from the sport, and even went so far as to say he's not even bothering to train or work out at all anymore, to work for the government (or some job like that) late last year, or are you just wating a while to remove him from the rankings?


I propose a ranking of girl fighters organized by bust size. Can someone get on this?
TOM
QUOTE(Cell @ Apr 9 2007, 01:31 PM) *
Hey TOM, were you aware that Ivan Menjivar officially retired from the sport, and even went so far as to say he's not even bothering to train or work out at all anymore, to work for the government (or some job like that) late last year, or are you just wating a while to remove him from the rankings?


I read that but wherever I read it I hadn't considered a very legit source. So if it's true then I'll remove him.

And I also support ClownCat's movement for female rankings by cup size.
evilclown
QUOTE(TOM @ Apr 9 2007, 10:44 PM) *
QUOTE(Cell @ Apr 9 2007, 01:31 PM) *
Hey TOM, were you aware that Ivan Menjivar officially retired from the sport, and even went so far as to say he's not even bothering to train or work out at all anymore, to work for the government (or some job like that) late last year, or are you just wating a while to remove him from the rankings?


I read that but wherever I read it I hadn't considered a very legit source. So if it's true then I'll remove him.

And I also support ClownCat's movement for female rankings by cup size.


It will be an important resource for tape collectors.
Scizzy
Matt Serra #1? When did Casebolt kidnap TOM and start posting under his name?

Incidentally, thanks for keeping the lists updated. They're a tremendous resource for anyone only moderately versed in MMA.
Lethal_Striker
Lightweight division has to be the most stacked division by far if someone like Roger Huerta is #38.
frenziedme
That and Huerta hasn't really beaten anyone of note.
Lethal_Striker
I'm not saying he should be ranked any higher, that wasn't the point I was trying to get across there. I was just saying that if he is ranked at #38 that just shows how ridiculously deep the division is.
TOM
List updated 4/15.

And interestingly, I came across some website known as MMA Playground today wherein someone had posted my lists but not given me credit. Bastards!
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